# Confusing Activity With Achievement

- Link: https://jarvislegacy.com/podcast/confusing-activity-with-achievement/
- Published: 2017-07-12T18:00:00-07:00
- Author: anchorwave

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Confusing Activity With Achievement

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The secret to get people through the failure gap.

On today’s episode Russell talks about disagreeing with a designer on what a customer
needs from Clickfunnels and how they were basically saying the complete opposite
of each other. Here are some of the interesting things you’ll hear in the this episode:

 * Why listening to what customers want is a good idea, but how it can only take
   you so far.
 * Why giving you’re customer little wins on their way to their goal, will help 
   them stick around.
 * And some of the wins are that Russell is giving his customers to help keep them
   as members of Clickfunnels.

 So listen here to find out how to confuse activity with achievement to keep customers
from leaving.

—Transcript—

What’s up everybody? This is Russell Brunson, welcome to the Marketing Secrets podcast.

Alright everybody, welcome to Marketing Secrets. I’m here today in the Clickfunnels
kitchen, the first time I’ve ever filmed in here. I’m excited. You guys want to 
see a quick view of what the kitchen looks like? Oh, there’s Dave. We’ve got a whole
bunch of cool stuff. We actually built this kitchen because for a lot of the products
we work with, for some reason we always need kitchen scenes, so we always rented
different kitchens. And then we’re like, if we build a kitchen make sure we have
a good scene so we can actually film stuff. So we do, but since we’ve had it we’ve
never used it for filming.

For today, I want to share with you guys something kind of interesting. And I want
to make sure when I say this that it doesn’t come off bad. Because it has a good
purpose, but it’s important for you guys to understand. Some of the background behind
this, to set it up so it all makes sense to you guys. We had a designer that worked
for us for a while to come on and help with user interface, UIUX, those type of 
things in Clickfunnels, a really smart guy. What he liked to do is call and interview
customers.

At first I was really excited. So he’d go and call 40 or 50 customers and interview
them, finding out what they want, what they didn’t want. All those kind of things,
which I thought was cool. We’ve never done that before. Some of you guys might have
actually talked to him, which is cool. Based on that he was trying to build UI and
structure based on customer’s feedback.

A couple of things I found with it. One is it was kind of almost a frustration, 
because I came to him saying, “This is what I want to have done.” And he treated
me kind of like if I was a customer, “Hey, cool. These are good ideas.” I’m like,“
No, you need to do this because I’m not asking you, I’m telling you. I’m not a survey.”
We always kind of went back and forth and in his mind it’s like, we need to find
out what the customers want, which I agree with. But also this comes back to Henry
Ford’s quote about if I were to ask my customers what they wanted; they would have
said they wanted a faster horse. You have to also understand that customers don’t
always know the vision where we’re going. That’s why we’re creating stuff, we’re
visionaries. We know where we’re trying to go.

So it’s kind of interesting, so he no longer works with the company, still an awesome
guy, but that was kind of this frustration I had. I remember for a long time we’ve
wanted to update our on-boarding in Clickfunnels, and we wanted to do a whole bunch
of cool things we haven’t been able to do. This week is actually fun for me because
we’re focusing on that.

Another side story, I was listening to Growth Hacker TV, there was an interview 
with a guy who bought the Warrior Forum. He also owned Freelancer.com and a bunch
of other companies. He was talking about how they grew to a billion dollar evaluation.
And one interesting thing he said is that they buy these companies and then they
look at the traffic coming through and spend a lot of time optimizing the processes
inside the processes to make more money from all the traffic coming, which is kind
of the phase we’re in right now.

We have anywhere from 800 – 1000 new people a day that sign up for Clickfunnels,
just organically. They’re coming from who knows where. And thank you for coming,
I don’t even know where you came from but I’m grateful to have you here. And they’re
coming in and we lose a bunch of them the first month, there’s a big drop off. After
that it stays really steady, but there’s a big drop immediately. So we’re trying
to figure out that process. How do we capture people and keep them in?

There’s a lot of cool stuff we’ve done that decreased our churn rate, which is the
number metric we look at. It increased our retention. But right now we’re in a big
overhaul, how do we simplify the sign up process? How do we make everything easier?
It’s fun, you guys will see some new stuff coming to Clickfunnels here in the next
60 days. A lot of new stuff will be coming live, which just simplifies the process
and makes Clickfunnels easier to use. So we’re excited for that.

But I was listening to this guy, and he talked about that’s what he was doing. They
just worked on the optimization of the sign up flow and that’s how the companies
blew up. They didn’t really focus on the traffic and these other things. And we’re
always focused on the traffic. But it’s like, how do we make sure the funnel’s right
so we’re not losing people out of the holes in the bucket?

So with that said, there’s a bunch of on-boarding stuff that I wanted to do and 
I know Todd wanted to do, so we kept trying to get this guy to do that. We want 
prize, we want to do free t-shirts, we want badges, we want to gamify the process.
And he kept coming back saying, “How does gamifying the process help the people 
get the end result? We need to get people to the end result and this is just keeping
people busy in the middle.” And it’s funny, Todd mentioned that this morning to 
me and I Voxed him back, there’s this quote from Dan Kennedy that I heard back in
the day that actually ties this in, but I couldn’t remember exactly what it was.
So I ended the Vox and said, “I’m going to go find the quote and come back to you.”

So I ended up finding the quote and I posted it there in Voxer and the quote said,“
You’ve got to confuse activity with accomplishment.” Now I’m going to be careful
when I say this because some of you guys are going to look at that and it might 
be frustrating or confusing or whatever. So I posted that and in the thing it said,
Dan Kennedy, “You have to get your customers to confuse activity with achievement.”
So Todd read that first before my Vox, and he thought I was saying, “Oh the designer
was right. That’s just going to get people confused. Focusing on activity as opposed
to achievement.” But if you listen to my Voxer, it was actually the exact opposite.

So what’s kind of funny, me and this UI designer both said the identical thing but
for the exact opposite side of the argument. He was saying you don’t want to give
people activities that keep them from the achievement. And I was saying, you want
to give them activities so that they feel achievement, so someday they get to achievement.
You want to confuse activity with achievement. Does that make sense?

So Kennedy said that, basically, as a retention strategy. People come in and are
going to leave. He said, no you need to give them things to do, so they have activity
that’s happening. Because the activity is what keeps them engaged. If we look at
our Clickfunnels stats right now and numbers and things like that, the interesting
parts are people that stick are people that have a custom domain, they log in at
least 2 ½ times per week. There’s all these stats. People that stick are people 
that are going in and doing stuff consistently. So we know that’s the metric. People
logging in and using it are the key. So how do get them to log in and use it?

Well just telling them to build a funnel, you’re going to have achievement, you’re
going to achieve a funnel. People will try for a little bit and then they’re going
to leave because they didn’t achieve anything. Because the goal is this huge thing.
The goal is you’ve got to eat the whole entire cow. That’s the goal. If you’re giving
your customer the goal to eat the cow, the problem is they’re going to come in and
if they don’t eat the cow really quick, they’re going to leave.

So what you have to do is confuse achievement with activity. Give them activities
to do that make them feel like they’re achieving something along the way. So they
come in and you set the table, you give them their appetizers, they eat that and
they achieve something. For us we’re gamifying the process. You come in, watch the
video, build your hero funnel, we send you a t-shirt. So you had activity, so you
felt you achievement, even though you didn’t achieve the thing you want yet. You
felt achievement, which then drives you forward to do the next thing and the next
thing, and the next thing.

All of us want our customers to have the achievement at the end, the problem is 
that they sign up and then there’s the achievement, there’s this huge gap in the
middle that they’re going to fall into, disappear and die. So because of that we
have to confuse activity with achievement, because that activity will make them 
feel micro-achievement which will get them to the big achievement at the end. That’s
the goal, that’s the message for you guys.

As you’re creating your training programs, software, ideas, products, services, 
whatever it is you’re creating and doing, I want you thinking about that. You have
to go and create activities that get people to feel small wins, small achievements
so that it will drive them through this chasm, this gap, to get to the big goal,
the big achievement that you want them to have. If you don’t have those, if you’re
not confusing activity with achievement initially, they’re never going to get to
the achievement.

So that’s kind of the message for today. I thought it was kind of interesting. I
thought it was funny that we both we had the same argument for why we wanted to 
do this on-boarding process. But he was saying it was a negative thing, but I was
saying it was a positive thing. I think it’s very positive, and I think we all can
and should be visiting it. So I hope that helps you guys, and with that said, have
an amazing day. Go back through your programs, products, services, member’s area
and figure out how you can weave those things in, because as you give people little
wins along the way, it will give them the momentum they need to get the big wins.
That’s all I got for you guys today. Thanks so much for everything, see you guys
soon. Bye.